Comments and answers on the Magna Carta 1215 page/title> <meta name="keywords" content="civil liberty,liberties,freedom,freedoms,civil right,rights,democracy,dictatorship,authoritarian,magna carta,King John,Runnymede,barons,1215,law,laws,Magna Carta,Great Charter,Articles of the Barons,1225,England,Runnymede,King John,King Henry III,Latin text,translation,"> <meta name="author" content="Xavier"> <meta name="copyright" content="© 2011, www.abelard.org and group1"> <meta name="description" content="Comments and answers on the Magna Carta 1215 page"> <meta name="subject" content="Comments and answers on the Magna Carta 1215 page"> <meta http-equiv="rating" content="General"> <meta http-equiv="distribution" content="global"> <script language="JavaScript">  </script> <link rel="SHORTCUT ICON" href="/favicon-red.ico"> <link href="/library/colours.css" rel="stylesheet" type="text/css"> <link href="/library/news1.css" rel="stylesheet" type="text/css"> </head> <body text="#cccccc" bgcolor="#000000" link="#6699ff" vlink="#6699ff" alink="#6699ff" onLoad="MM_preloadImages('../library/abstract.png','../library/bills.png','../library/declare.png','../library/bills.png','../library/orient.png','../library/links.png','../library/marihome.png')"> .   <table width="70%" border="0" align="center" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="1" summary="navigation bar for 'history of the nine principles of policing' page on the magnacartaplus.org site"> <tr> <td width="92" height="51" valign="top"><a href="/abstracts/index.htm"><img src="/library/abstract.png" title="abstracts button on 'history of the nine principles of policing - 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on the magnacartaplus.org site" width="103" height="30" border="0"></a> </td> <td width="11"><img src="/library/space.png" title="space on 'history of the nine principles of policing' page on the magnacartaplus.org site" width="2" height="20"></td> <td width="109" valign="top"><a href="/links/index.htm"><img src="/library/links.png" title="links button on 'history of the nine principles of policing - on the magnacartaplus.org site" width="92" height="30" border="0"></a> </td> </tr> </table> <table width="700" border="0" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="1" summary="***" align="center" name="document_title"> <tr> <td width="71%" align="center" rowspan="4"> <h1><font color="#FF6666" face="Arial, Helvetica" size="7">Comments and answers<br> - the 1215 Magna Carta</font></h1> <p> <form name="form2"> <select name="declarations" onChange="MM_jumpMenu('parent',this,1)"> <option selected>::Declarations of Rights, both historic and from around the world::</option> <option value="/magnacarta/index.htm">Magna Carta or Great Charter of Great Britain, 1215</option> <option value="/1689-rights/index.htm">1689 Bill of Rights [Great Britain]</option> <option value="/usa-rights/index.htm">Bill of Rights in the United States of America, 1791 [U.S.A]</option> <option value="/french-rights/1789.htm">Declaration of the Rights of Man and of the Citizen, 1789 [France]</option> <option value="/charters-&-declarations/germany.php">Basic Law for the Federal Republic of Germany (section 1 - Basic Rights), 1949 [Germany]</option> <option value="/charters-&-declarations/canada.htm">Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms (selected clauses), 1867 to 1997 [Canada]</option> <option value="/uno-docs/univ-right.htm">Universal Declaration of Human Rights, 1948</option> <option value="/echr/index.htm">European Convention for Protection of Human Rights and Fundamental Freedoms, 1950</option> <option value="/uno-docs/covenant.htm">United Nations International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights, 1966</option> <option value="/uno-docs/e-s-c.htm">United Nations Covenant on Economic, Social,and Cultural Rights, 1966</option> <option value="/uno-docs/genocide.htm">United Nations Convention against Genocide, 1985 (summary)</option> <option value="/uno-docs/c-a-t.htm">United Nations Convention against Torture, 1985 (summary)</option> <option value="/uno-docs/index.htm">Summary of United Nations Agreements on Human Rights</option> </select> </form><p></p></td> <td width="12%" rowspan="4"><a href="/index.htm"><img src="/library/marihome.png" width="119" height="116" border="0" alt="back to magnacartaplus.org index page"></a></td> </tr> </table> <table width="90%" border="0" align="center" cellpadding="8" cellspacing="0"> <tr> <td width="18%" align="center" valign="top">  <script language="" type="text/javascript">  </script> <script type="text/javascript" src="http://pagead2.googlesyndication.com/pagead/show_ads.js"> </script>  </td> <td width="62%">  <form method="get" action="http://www.google.com/custom" target="google_window"> <table border="0" bgcolor="#000000"> <tr> <td nowrap="nowrap" valign="top" align="left" height="32"> <a href="http://www.google.com/"> <img src="http://www.google.com/logos/Logo_25blk.gif" border="0" alt="Google"></a> </td> <td nowrap="nowrap"> <input type="hidden" name="domains" value="abelard.org"> <input type="text" name="q" size="20" maxlength="255" value=""> <input type="submit" name="sa" value="Search"> </td> </tr> <tr> <td> </td> <td nowrap="nowrap"> <table> <tr> <td> <input type="radio" name="sitesearch" value=""> <font size="-1" color="#ffffff">Web</font> </td> <td> <input type="radio" name="sitesearch" value="abelard.org" checked="checked"> <font size="-1" color="#ffffff">abelard.org</font> </td> </tr> </table> <input type="hidden" name="client" value="pub-7387454084211988"> <input type="hidden" name="forid" value="1"> <input type="hidden" name="channel" value="6624356613"> <input type="hidden" name="ie" value="ISO-8859-1"> <input type="hidden" name="oe" value="ISO-8859-1"> <input type="hidden" name="cof" value="GALT:#00FF00;GL:1;DIV:#33FF33;VLC:00FF00;AH:center;BGC:000000;LBGC:000000;ALC:66FFFF;LC:66FFFF;T:CCCCCC;GFNT:00CC00;GIMP:00CC00;LH:50;LW:63;L:http://userpic.livejournal.com/18354399/4102511;S:http://www.abelard.org/;FORID:1;"> <input type="hidden" name="hl" value="en"> </td> </tr> </table> </form>  </td> <td width="20%" align="center" valign="top"> </td> </tr> </table> <table width="700" border="0" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="5" align="center"> <tr> <td valign="top"> <p class="FF9">From Jan Ford</p> <blockquote> <p>I wonder if you could possibly assist with a 13th century definition of a word used within the Magna Carta.</p> <p> From the prospective [sic.] of King John, The Barons and the Clergy; indeed, all parties involved in the formulation and creation of the document, what would their definition of the term Kingdom have been/what would the Kingdom have consisted of in 1215 from their point of view?</p> </blockquote> <p class="FF9">From <span class="bold">magnacartaplus.org</span> - Xavier</p> <blockquote> <p>Yes, I will do my best to help you.</p> <p>To my mind, and having consulted <strong>abelard</strong> (<strong>magnacartaplus.org</strong> is a subsidiary, but independent, site to <a href="http://www.abelard.org/" target="_blank" class="extlnk">abelard.org</a>), Kingdom would be the lands, peoples, buildings and livestock therein belonging to the King. The King regarded his kingdom as given to him by God - a God-given right. The barons and other land office owners like bishops had been given their lands, status and privileges by the King in return for their loyalty, income (taxes), military support. In fact, they were feudal tenants. There is a fair amount of information, it can require attentive reading, both in our <a href="index.htm" class="yel1">Magna Carta translation</a> and in <a href="definitions.htm" class="yel1">the Glossary</a> (words in Magna Carta are linked in <span class="editorial">light green</span> to the Glossary).</p> <p>As for the physical extent of the Kingdom, well, looking at the start of the Magna Carta:</p> <blockquote> <p> John, by the grace of God, king of England, lord of Ireland, duke of Normandy and Aquitaine, and count of Anjou</p> </blockquote> <p>= England, Ireland, and most of the western side of France. Normandy, of course, came from William the Conqueror, the other French territories came from the marriage of John’s father Henry II to Eleanor of Aquitaine.<br> From one of the <span class="bold">abelard.org</span> pages <a href="http://www.abelard.org/france/cathedrals3-poitiers.php" target="_blank" class="extlnk">about Poitiers cathedral</a>:</p> <blockquote> <p> Poitiers was the centre of the great Angevin expansion, developed over several generations by the Dukes of Anjou engaging in strategic marriages until, under the great Henry II, the Plantagenet empire included England and the whole of Western France.</p> <p> This was when Paris was small, weak and limited. Unfortunately, despite bringing law and prosperity across his empire by his great energy, Henry II was a complete dud as a father and his children grew up quarrelling and variously less able.</p> <p> Meanwhile, the Capetians in Paris had the good sense to reign for very long periods (three of them each reigned for over thirty years) and, thus, developed coherent policy and stability.</p> <p> At this time, Henry’s elder son Richard was mostly interested in war, storming castles and going on a beat-up to the Holy Land. He became a great general, got himself killed and left his brother John to pick up the pieces in administering England.</p> <p> But John did not defend his French interests well, England fought with an interminable number of Louis, so by the 17th century the English were finally pushed out France. It was then that Elizabeth I is supposed to have said, “When they bury me, they will find Calais engraved on my heart.”</p> </blockquote> </blockquote> <p><a href="#index"><img src="/library/index-mc.png" width="70" height="38" align="right" alt="return to the index on the 'Magna Carta, 1215 - English translation' page" border="0"></a></p> <p align="center"><script type="text/javascript"> </script> <script type="text/javascript" src="http://pagead2.googlesyndication.com/pagead/show_ads.js"> </script></p> <p> </p> <h3><font face="Arial, Helvetica" color="#ff0000"><a name="associated-docs"></a><font color="#FF3366">Associated documents </font></font></h3> <blockquote> <p>[Underlined documents are available. Other documents are in preparation.]</p> <p><a href="latin.htm" class="FF9"><strong>The 1215 Magna Carta – original Latin text</strong></a><br> The 1225 Magna Carta – an English translation<br> The 1225 MagnaCarta– original Latin text<br> <a href="definitions.htm" class="FF9"><strong>Glossary</strong></a><br> Historical background<br> Attacks on the substance of the Magna Carta</p> </blockquote> <h2><a name="colour-key"></a><font face="Arial, Helvetica" color="#FF3366">Colour key</font></h2> <blockquote>Articles <font color="#FFFF99"><strong>in light yellow</strong></font> were still valid until recently under the charter of 1225, but with a few minor amendments. <br> Articles <font color="#FF99FF"><strong>in pink</strong></font> were omitted in all later reissues of the charter. </blockquote> <blockquote> <p>Words <span class="editorial2">in light green</span> can be found in the glossary.<br> Words and phrases <span class="aoikowriter"><strong>in blue</strong></span><font color="#3366FF"> </font>link to parts of this document.<br> Words and phrases <span class="yel-bld">in yellow </span>link to parts of this document.<br> Words and phrases <span class="extlnk-bld">in green </span>link to web pages external to <strong>magnacartaplus.org</strong>. </p> </blockquote></td> <td width="22%" align="center" valign="top"> <p> <script type="text/javascript"> </script> <script type="text/javascript" src="http://pagead2.googlesyndication.com/pagead/show_ads.js"> </script> <br> <a href="/choose/choose.htm#disclaimer"class="yel1">advertising <br> disclaimer</a> <p> <p>  <script language="" type="text/javascript">  </script> <script type="text/javascript" src="http://pagead2.googlesyndication.com/pagead/show_ads.js"> </script>  <p> <p> <script type="text/javascript"> </script> <script type="text/javascript" src="http://pagead2.googlesyndication.com/pagead/show_ads.js"> </script> <br> <a href="/choose/choose.htm#disclaimer"class="yel1">advertising <br> disclaimer</a> </td> </tr> </table> <hr> <table width="700" border="0" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="5" align="center" name="end_matter"> <tr> <td height="113"> <p><font size="-1">email <a href="mailto:feedback@magnacartaplus.org">feedback@magnacartaplus.org</a></font></p> <p><font size="-1">© magnacartaplus.org 27 november 2011</font> <br> <script language="JavaScript" type="text/JavaScript"></script> </p> <p><font size="-1" >the address for this document is <a href="http://www.magnacartaplus.org/magnacarta/comments_magna_carta.php">http://www.magnacartaplus.org/magnacarta/comments_magna_carta.php</a></font></p> <p><font size="-1"> </font> <font size="-1">prints as 1 A4 pages (on my printer and set-up)</font> <p> </td> </tr> </table> <br> <table width="70%" border="0" align="center" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="1" summary="navigation bar for 'history of the nine principles of policing' page on the magnacartaplus.org site"> <tr> <td width="92" height="51" valign="top"><a href="/abstracts/index.htm"><img src="/library/abstract.png" title="abstracts button on 'history of the nine principles of policing - 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